Question of the Day ??
Do you believe in the doctrine of "once saved, always saved"?
How would you back up your answer?
posted by Greg Hazelrig @ 9:36 AM
8 comments
BroGreg.com
Thoughts on GOD and TRUTH (found somewhere in the middle of ultra-conservatism and flaming liberalism)
Monday, September 25, 2006
How would you back up your answer?
About Me
- Name: Greg Hazelrig
- Location: Hernando, Mississippi, United States
I have been a pastor in the United Methodist Church since 1999 when I accepted the call to preach. Today I pastor Bakers Chapel UMC in Hernando, MS.
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8 Comments:
Greg,
This is any excellent question and it reflects one the few differences that I have with my Baptist friends.
I think Rev. Wesley delt with this perfectly. The once saved, always saved Christians like to point to the exact year, month, day, and hour that they were saved. John Wesley never really asked a person, when exactly were you saved? John Wesley basically asked the question like this (my paraphrase)
Are you currently, right now, trusting in the Lord Jesus Christ and his blood attonement on the cross and the Grace that He extends to you, for your salvation?
Wesley's question is a living, dynamic quesion, not a matter of historical fact. I have to always put my faith in Christ, every single minute, hour, day, and year. I can never let go. My salvation is on going with my faith in Christ and the Grace He extends to me, not some point in the historical past. I think that Rev. Wesley has it right.
I am a free moral agent. I choose to accept the Grace that Christ extends to me, but likewise, I believe that I could choose to reject it again. I mean, Lucifer was one of the greatest created beings that the Lord made. He didn't need salvation and if he could reject God, what makes me think I cannot?
I'm with Keith - once saved always saved implies some sort of magic trick or something. I think God's offeirng of grace to us is the only constant, but we can certainly reject that grace even after we once knew it.
See Keith's answer
Good answer Keith. I would love to hear from a Baptist or Calvinistic point of view as well. I wonder if any of those folks ever get lost over here on my blog. If so, I invite your rebuttal.
If so, lets all remember to keep things civil though. I mean the only real argument we should be having is the BBQ argument (which by the way, I'm right ha ha !!)
This is a deliberate redundancy, but I believe in "once really saved, always really saved." The point is that some who "fall away" weren't ever there to begin with.
I have read all the pro and con scriptures and see the tension there, but the concept that we could jump in and out of salvation just doesn't fly with me.
Does anyone know of a good, balanced debate on the topic? (chock full of scripture, of course!)
Mat 7:21 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 On that day many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?'
Mat 7:23 And then will I declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.'
My paraphrase:
"Not everyone who says "I believe" is faithful.
Not everyone who says "I've been saved" has been, or if they have, will remain so.'
Saving faith is much more than "I believe."
Scripture does not support the "once saved, always saved" position.
"once really saved, always really saved" may seem to be logically consistent. The problem is that it inserts a condition that neatly defends the doctrine against very clear evidence against it, but once again with no Scriptural basis.
I have found this particularly curious since my Baptist friends (and I do love and respect them) usually consider themselves more biblical that Methodists. When it comes to working out our theology, doctrine, and ethics, however, that is simply not consistently the case.
Perhaps I am a "Metho-Baptist". . .I belong to a Baptist church and wandered over here, so at the invitation of the blog owner, I am posting. The first Scripture I remember memorizing is John 3:16: "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish, but have eternal life." (only I memorized it from the KJ Bible many years ago!) This Scripture says if you believe in Jesus, then you have eternal life. So if one dies with that belief, he is assured of eternal life. The question should more appropriately be 'Can one believe and then quit believing?'. I think a person may be able to do that, in which case, he could die without believing and would not have eternal life. But if he is once saved, he is always saved, unless by his own choice he renounces it. . .my Baptist opinion anyway. All I know from the Scriptures is that anyone who is saved has eternal life.
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